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Fuchikoma 1329th Post
Red Carpet Executive Member
| "Re(3):Re(10):mini-games" , posted Sat 28 May 12:35
quote:
Link
Ahaaa so Klonoa is Kuroro Gunsou... I knew it. :P That list is primarily the playable characters... it doesn't list the boss characters like Juli,Juni,Cammy,Lillith,Zabel,Joker,Janga,Dark Bravo Man, Black Valkyrie,Rose,Devil Kazuya, and so on...
Man does this game just go on FOREVER! At least Guy/Sho finally came back... their super where they do Guy's raging demon style attack from SFA2 Gold has to be my favorite super move in the game. What's worse is you're fighting the same damn bosses over and over... I've fought Aya and those Horse guys like 5 times already... Janga and Joker probably 3 times... just DIE ALREADY.
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Gojira 1735th Post
Tailored Carpet V.I.P- Platinum Member
| "Re(1):Character list" , posted Sun 29 May 05:25
LOL
Well, if we're done applauding Iggy for his shrewd business sense, I might as well give some detailed impressions too...
Although it's a strategy game it seems the basic idea behind every stage is to give you a huge number of characters to control and throw an even bigger amount of enemies at you. As you defeat one wave of enemies a new wave will appear. There are very few shortcuts to finishing a stage, so it definitely takes a long time. Actually if there wasn't a quick evasion option I'd probably get sick of defending everything.
The dialogue is pretty funny sometimes; sure there's a lot of it in the main story, but also whenever you fight a new monster for the first time, sometimes the characters will comment on it. Like Shion it seems has a serious problem with frogs, and when Morrigan first engages Saya Demitri comments on how strangely similar they are. Unfortunately I can't read Japanese very fast so sometimes I'd get impatient and skip these, but it's still a nice touch.
One thing that's sure to disappoint many is that customization in the game seems very sparse. You can equip accessories for stat boosting and stock items for healing on characters (each unit can hold about 6 items), but otherwise I couldn't find anything that lets you change the attacks or the units to your liking. Things like that just happen automatically when you level up a certain amount or reach a certain part of the story.
Nonetheless, overall it's fun in a mindlessly addictive way. You can save in the middle of a stage or at the end, but it's hard to put down when you wonder what's going to happen or who's going to show up next. I actually forgot to eat anything yesterday because of this game. So now I'm hungry but instead of eating I feel like talking about the game, haha.
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Pollyanna 1127th Post
Red Carpet Premium Member+
| "Re(2):Character list" , posted Sun 29 May 06:39
Since Iggy asked so long ago, I'll give my impressions of the game as well. I think it's being bashed a bit too much, because...well, there are bad games and there are good games, and this one isn't one of the bad ones. As Gojira said, it's very VERY addicting. First, though...I have a lot of complaints before I get to what I like.
I thoroughly disagree with anyone who thinks that this would be better off as an anime, because everything about the game, excluding the battle system, is weak. It would be the most pointless, not-funny, not exciting, rambling anime ever produced.
The biggest problem with the game is that the characters talk too much and they don't have anything good to say. EVERYONE talks for EVERYTHING ALL THE TIME. The fight always stops at least once for a (often) lengthy conversation, usually about nothing at all. Many, if not most of the characters are simply not interesting enough to talk THIS much. Sure, you think that it would have some great inside jokes, but the writing is usually so mediocre that you're better off forgetting about the game and buying second-rate doujinshi instead. I don't want to knock it TOO much, because there is an occassional good joke or line, but they're swallowed in a sea of crap that I have to swim through to look for them.
Perhaps the worst thing about the dialogue/story is that it has absolutely no focal point or theme. The characters are so mismatched that when the game tries to do everything, it succeeds in doing nothing. The opening had a good feel to it that I thought would pervade thematically in the game, but that's not the case. The plot is most disorganized and meaningless thing I've ever seen. I realize that this was inevitable, but it doesn't have an overlying ANYTHING and even the scenes can't carry a solid idea across. There are times...usually when a small group of characters are speaking, that it works, but never in big groups.
Also...although everyone knows this...the art is terrible. It's some of the worst I've ever seen. And yet...somehow the Justice Gakuen characters came out looking perfect. I don't get it.
But...I think the game is totally redeemed by its battle system, which not only looks beautiful, but is arguably the most fun system I've played with in a while. I can't believe no one has said this yet, but the battles are very much like Valkyrie Profile's. If you're a big fan of VP's battle system, then that's reason enough to get the game. Although they require no strategy at all and have so many characters on screen that you completely forget about half of them, the combo system is just WAY too much fun. Even if I'm not challenged by the fight itself, I'm always challenged to create bigger and better combos to wipe out enemies in one shot.
This is why this game is so much better than SRW. In SRW, you're not in control of your attack. When you wipe out an enemy, you just push a button. But in this game, you've constructed a beautiful combo attack. You actually DID something...and it was fun. This combined with my tendency to try and keep my teams balanced in terms of EXP keeps me entertained. The fact that you're always learning new moves/upgrades to current moves keeps things fresh.
Actually...they keep things fresh very well with introductions to new characters and surprise appearances in the middle of battles. If Namco hadn't totally revealed every character (though I'm still surprised by some bosses) ahead of time, then the surprise would be really enjoyable.
I forgot to say...to anyone who hasn't played the game...when I first saw videos, I was afraid that the animations would take too long, but that's not the case at all (excluding the double moves) because you're in control of every attack. Defending is boring, but attacking is not.
There are many people who will play this game and hope they get it right for the sequel. If they can streamline the battle system a little more (I think La Pucelle could teach them a few things) and make the times when you aren't killing people more fun, then they'll have a truly excellent game. As it is, the game is still good enough to not get lost in the "I hope the sequel (if there is one) is good" mentality. It's also good enough to temporarily make me put Hanjuku Hero 4 aside, which is a HUGE accomplishment, especially after I watched the opening.
On a final note...to those of you who keep bitching about this not coming to America, or talking endlessly about it happening...give it a rest. If you import the game, you'll still be able to appreciate the best part of it. If I was Namco, I don't know if I'd bring it over or not. If you're one of those who complains about games not coming over here, but is too lame to import them, then shut the hell up. I hate to be rude, but I'm sick of hearing this everywhere all the time.
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Sano 1793th Post
Silver Carpet V.I.P- Platinum Executive
| "Re(3):Character list" , posted Sun 29 May 07:58
quote: On a final note...to those of you who keep bitching about this not coming to America, or talking endlessly about it happening...give it a rest. If you import the game, you'll still be able to appreciate the best part of it. If I was Namco, I don't know if I'd bring it over or not. If you're one of those who complains about games not coming over here, but is too lame to import them, then shut the hell up. I hate to be rude, but I'm sick of hearing this everywhere all the time.
Like I said before I myself will wait a year and see what happens, if I don't hear about a translation by then we'll all definitly know it's not coming here. In one year I'll have a PS3, modding my PS2 to play Japanese games won't be such a big deal. And after one year since I don't understand Japanese there should be some good Faqs at Gamefaqs to help me walk through it, much like the Faq for the Rurouni Kenshin RPG game. And that's all I have to say about that.
Ryu and Chun-Li forever!
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ONSLAUGHT 3367th Post
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
| "Mmmmhh..." , posted Sun 29 May 11:12
quote:
On a final note...to those of you who keep bitching about this not coming to America, or talking endlessly about it happening...give it a rest. If you import the game, you'll still be able to appreciate the best part of it. If I was Namco, I don't know if I'd bring it over or not. If you're one of those who complains about games not coming over here, but is too lame to import them, then shut the hell up. I hate to be rude, but I'm sick of hearing this everywhere all the time.
I love when they get "rude". By the way, how can you tell people to stop bitching, when your "import" collection consists of ISOs on blank DVDs? Perhaps the people that bitch are waiting for a proper release in ENGLISH! I mean, not everyone is an otaku that pretend to know japanese because they love the anime and know how to say "kawaii". Are you fluent in japanese to fully enjoy the game? or you just understand some of it? If so, congratulations, but not everyone here knows 27 different languages just to play some games. So, if you don't like people that bitch when a game is not coming to America or Europe, then shut the hell up. I hate to be rude, but I'm sick of hearing stupid elitist shit everywhere all the time.
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Gojira 1737th Post
Tailored Carpet V.I.P- Platinum Member
| "Re(4):Character list" , posted Sun 29 May 12:13:
quote:
The biggest problem with the game is that the characters talk too much and they don't have anything good to say. EVERYONE talks for EVERYTHING ALL THE TIME. The fight always stops at least once for a (often) lengthy conversation, usually about nothing at all. Many, if not most of the characters are simply not interesting enough to talk THIS much. Sure, you think that it would have some great inside jokes, but the writing is usually so mediocre that you're better off forgetting about the game and buying second-rate doujinshi instead. I don't want to knock it TOO much, because there is an occassional good joke or line, but they're swallowed in a sea of crap that I have to swim through to look for them.
The amount of talking is definitely staggering, and this will definitely bother some people, but I wouldn't go so far as to say that most of them are worthless. In my experience crossovers are full of things like this, so I've come to expect it from them (or at least gotten used to it).
And the battle system does have a similarity with Valkyrie Profile since you sometimes control two characters at once, but the impression I got was more like a slightly altered version of Xenogears, which makes sense given the developer.
quote: I think I would like the battle system better if there was some customize feature. It's all just O then O and any direction until you branch out. The only advantage to completing a combo is it will give you a little hp or mp.
Limits of the battle scene don't bother me too much... the only thing that really annoys me about not being able to customize is that some attacks get replaced by a level up and you never see them again. Like Jin's Laser Cannon gets replaced by the double-punch. He still has Laser Scraper but still there is a difference; it would have been nice to be able to decide which attack I want replaced instead of being forced into it.
As for comboing, I'm still trying to figure out what affects what (Monolith Soft never fails to confuse me with its overabundant stats and meters), but I'm sure there's a little more to it than recovery. Even though you can let them hit the ground and still keep attacking, you gain a branch or two if you can keep them in the air long enough. And those green triangles on the left seem to have some purpose too (EXP?).
EDIT: POWERUP
[this message was edited by Gojira on Sun 29 May 12:34] |
Juke Joint Jezebel 3407th Post
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
| "Re(1):Mmmmhh..." , posted Sun 29 May 12:17
quote: On a final note...to those of you who keep bitching about this not coming to America, or talking endlessly about it happening...give it a rest. If you import the game, you'll still be able to appreciate the best part of it. If I was Namco, I don't know if I'd bring it over or not. If you're one of those who complains about games not coming over here, but is too lame to import them, then shut the hell up. I hate to be rude, but I'm sick of hearing this everywhere all the time.
hahaha
quote: I love when they get "rude". By the way, how can you tell people to stop bitching, when your "import" collection consists of ISOs on blank DVDs? Perhaps the people that bitch are waiting for a proper release in ENGLISH! I mean, not everyone is an otaku that pretend to know japanese because they love the anime and know how to say "kawaii". Are you fluent in japanese to fully enjoy the game? or you just understand some of it? If so, congratulations, but not everyone here knows 27 different languages just to play some games. So, if you don't like people that bitch when a game is not coming to America or Europe, then shut the hell up. I hate to be rude, but I'm sick of hearing stupid elitist shit everywhere all the time.
zing!
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Pollyanna 1128th Post
Red Carpet Premium Member+
| "Re(1):Mmmmhh..." , posted Sun 29 May 16:09
quote: By the way, how can you tell people to stop bitching, when your "import" collection consists of ISOs on blank DVDs? Perhaps the people that bitch are waiting for a proper release in ENGLISH! I mean, not everyone is an otaku that pretend to know japanese because they love the anime and know how to say "kawaii". Are you fluent in japanese to fully enjoy the game? or you just understand some of it? If so, congratulations, but not everyone here knows 27 different languages just to play some games. So, if you don't like people that bitch when a game is not coming to America or Europe, then shut the hell up. I hate to be rude, but I'm sick of hearing stupid elitist shit everywhere all the time.
How am I elitist? I want people to shut up and import the game. If I was elitist I would taunt people about not having an English release. There are some games that I'm "elitist" about because they aren't worth it for people who can't understand Japanese, but generally speaking, I wish people would import more games.
People have the power to play NXC and enjoy it even if they don't speak Japanese. If they can't be happy with that, that's their problem, but it doesn't make me elitist...unless I'm in an elite group of people who aren't weenies. I've imported games for years, many before I understood any Japanese. I got sick of relying on US companies and decided to enjoy whatever games I wanted.
Also, assuming that my "import collection" is nothing but burns is like accusing a social drinker of being a raging alcoholic.
I admit that bitching about bitching is hypocritical and that I should have kept my "mouth shut", though bitching about my bitching isn't any better.
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Shingo The One 549th Post
New Red Carpet Member
| "Re(2):Mmmmhh..." , posted Sun 29 May 16:33
quote: By the way, how can you tell people to stop bitching, when your "import" collection consists of ISOs on blank DVDs? Perhaps the people that bitch are waiting for a proper release in ENGLISH! I mean, not everyone is an otaku that pretend to know japanese because they love the anime and know how to say "kawaii". Are you fluent in japanese to fully enjoy the game? or you just understand some of it? If so, congratulations, but not everyone here knows 27 different languages just to play some games. So, if you don't like people that bitch when a game is not coming to America or Europe, then shut the hell up. I hate to be rude, but I'm sick of hearing stupid elitist shit everywhere all the time.
How am I elitist? I want people to shut up and import the game. If I was elitist I would taunt people about not having an English release. There are some games that I'm "elitist" about because they aren't worth it for people who can't understand Japanese, but generally speaking, I wish people would import more games.
People have the power to play NXC and enjoy it even if they don't speak Japanese. If they can't be happy with that, that's their problem, but it doesn't make me elitist...unless I'm in an elite group of people who aren't weenies. I've imported games for years, many before I understood any Japanese. I got sick of relying on US companies and decided to enjoy whatever games I wanted.
Also, assuming that my "import collection" is nothing but burns is like accusing a social drinker of being a raging alcoholic.
I admit that bitching about bitching is hypocritical and that I should have kept my "mouth shut", though bitching about my bitching isn't any better.
I agree with you Pollyanna.I don't give a fuck about this shit.As long as the game is long and fun, just like this one, I don't care if it's in Japanese.Seriously, there are very few games which are very good and have excellent voice acting in English.As for import games, if something's worth my time and my money, I buy it, I play it and I enjoy it.And it's also a good way to broaden my horizons, since it's the first time I ever played a game like this.So enjoy NamcoXCapcom at least for the fantastic seiyuu and the cool action.
There is a difference between doing it FIRST and doing it RIGHT.
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Pollyanna 1129th Post
Red Carpet Premium Member+
| "Re(4):Mmmmhh..." , posted Sun 29 May 18:02
I forgot to reply to everyone else. Look for your name!
Fuchikoma: What do you mean "the only advantage to completing a combo"? Comboing gives you damage bonuses, MP/HP bonuses and EXP bonuses. Did I misunderstand you, or did you misunderstand the system? Anyway, I'd just like to be able to pick my team more often. I'd have enough customization if I could "customize" the characters I dislike off my team. I don't really mind the lack of customization because the battle system is interesting.
Sano: Funny you mention the RK RPG. That was one of the first RPGs I imported.
Gojira: Maybe I would have a higher tolerance for the bad dialogue if it didn't go along with a bad plot with no focus. Novelty only takes you so far. I was really hoping when I saw preview videos and the opening, that the game would have an uplifting cheesy justice theme. Unfortunately, it can't even keep the plot in focus. The system is like VP, regardless of how many character you have, because you're trying to link a series of attacks together to get a larger combo to get more bonuses and shoot for a "super move". I'm not saying this because I don't think you understand, I'm just saying that that's exactly what you do in VP, but not in Xenogears.
Yeah...and there's way too much crap on the screen sometimes. It took me a while to figure it out, myself.
Maou: Ah...is Zill'Ol bad? I thought the remake looked pretty, but I was highly reluctant to buy it, given the plethora of other games available. Also, I think there are a lot of games that might be good, but simply aren't worth the effort of bringing over. That's my verdict on NXC. It's a decent game that Americans might like, but for the trouble, it's hardly worth the risk and the effort. I try to look at things from the perspective of the company as well as the consumer. People who get really excited about import games tend to think that other consumers will feel the same way (and the company somehow owes them something, when that isn't necessarily the case.
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Pollyanna 1130th Post
Red Carpet Premium Member+
| "Re(6):Mmmmhh..." , posted Sun 29 May 19:05
quote: What I'm saying about the combo system is that at least for me I'm just doing the combo because it recharges some HP/MP and charges up your super meter.
The combos are fun for a while... but then they just became tedious. If there was some option for a Super Robot Wars style automatic attack... I'd go for it just to speed things up. Defending is even more tedious.
I guess mixing up your moves in a combo does give you a little more freedom than a preset attack. It's certainly the only way to "customize" in the game... how many hours do you have to play until you can actually pick who you want on a team?... like 15 hours or so. If I could I would have ditched Klonoa/Ganz, Tarosuke/Kagekiyo, and other worthless characters right away. Also after you've played like close to 30 hours and you're still getting new guys like Arthur, Strider, and Captain Commando... they're pretty weak compared to characters that you've been leveling up for most of the game like Ryu and Kos Mos.
Well, the biggest advantage to doing big combos is that it ups your branch, so you can kill enemies (hopefully) in one turn. Trying to minimize enemy turns and speed up the battle as a result is my primary objective when I'm playing.
Regardless, if you're not into the combo system (which I think is a little more complex than you're making it out to be) I can certainly understand why you would want more customization. At the same time, though...if you're not into the battle system, I have no idea what you're getting out of the game at this point.
If there was an auto option, I think it would be "unfair" if it optimized your attack. For one, even if I do a good combo, there's no guarantee I'll get it right the next time. For some characters, timing is more complicated. If it gave you a non-optimized attack (not as much damage as you'd get from a good combo) and cut the animation (or gave you the option to), I might say it's a good idea, but otherwise, it just takes too much from the system. The game is NOT a good (traditional) SRPG by any means, so when you take out its interesting battle system and reduce it to that, then the game has very little going for it.
I don't find Tarosuke/Kagekiyo useless at all, just...more difficult to combo with. If I can get the timing right, then they're actually one of the strongest teams I have. I dunno if they're stronger than Kos-mos, but...then again, it's also hard to screw up with her.
My opinion may change when I make it as far as you, but I'm liking the game more and more as I go, excluding a few ridiculously long battles. Still, they put more thought into the enemy positions/HP/backup than they do in SRW by a LONG SHOT.
Oh, and hey! I didn't know your Japanese was good...AND you pirated the game. That means you can join my ELITIST JAPANESE PIRATE SOCIETY. Sugoi! People who pay for things they can get for free are bakas!
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Fuchikoma 1335th Post
Red Carpet Executive Member
| "Re(7):Mmmmhh..." , posted Sun 29 May 20:06
I think what's got me so turned off about the battle system... really the whole game... is the length of the battles. There's a point in the game where yeah if you can manage to complete a combo without the guy ever hitting the ground you can kill him in one turn. The enemies get tougher though and that's no longer possible with most characters (except your strongest ones)... but most of the time you can't choose your characters so you're also stuck with the weak and worthless ones. My Sakura/Karin can do two complete combo chains and hardly ever kill someone on the first try now.
Just doing the same combo over and over on the same enemies over and over has worn thin. I currently stopped playing the game... and probably in a day or two I'll go back and it'll be interesting again.
Kagekiyo becomes pretty worthless when you get Mitsurugi. Mitsu has similar moves, but they're easier to time... plus he has a counter which Kagekiyo does not. There's actually quite a few redundant characters... that basically have the same attack patterns... Ryu and Ken, Bruce/Regina and Fong/LeiLei, Tron Bonne and Fuuba/Mack, Klonoa/Ganz and Hiromi/Masyo, Stan/Ruthie and Gil/Kai... it makes me wish they would have really diversified more with someone from Katamari, Ridge Racer, Time Crisis, Bionic Commando, Viewtiful Joe, Devil May Cry, and so on....
ELITIST JAPANESE PIRATE SOCIETY eh? So the EJPS... that's beyond elite... beyond L337... it's リートー! Now excuse me while I stare at my Wario Ware Touched rom that has no working emulator to play it with....
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Maou 652th Post
Red Carpet Regular Member
| "Re(6):Mmmmhh..." , posted Mon 30 May 02:54:
Fuchikoma and Polly: your elite American pirate importer speak is just a little too realistic, and now I have a stomach ache.
Is Zill'Ol bad? I don't know, it might be fine, but it was just one of those games I could see people complaining about not getting in America, just because. These days, it's hard for a game not to get translated unless it really sucks... especially with Working Designs, Ubi Soft, and Atlus translating lesser-known good (and sometimes bad) RPG's, too. Not that I can judge whether I will buy a Japanese-made game based on whether it went to America, since plenty of dreck still gets translated, but it seems like very few good things fail to be exported.
人間はいつも私を驚かせてくれる。不思議なものだな、人間という存在は...
[this message was edited by Maou on Mon 30 May 03:01] |
Radish 2877th Post
Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master
| "Re(7):Mmmmhh..." , posted Mon 30 May 03:05
quote: Fuchikoma and Polly: your elite American pirate importer speak is just a little too realistic, and now I have a stomach ache.
Is Zill'Ol bad? I don't know, it might be fine, but it was just one of those games I could see people complaining about not getting in America, just because. These days, it's hard for a game not to get translated unless it really sucks... especially with Working Designs, Ubi Soft, and Atlus translating lesser-known good (and sometimes bad) RPG's, too. Not that I can judge whether I will buy a Japanese-made game based on whether it went to America, since plenty of dreck still gets translated, but it seems like very few good things fail to be exported.
Yeah pretty much nowadays the only games that don't get localized are games that are:
1. Absolutely god awful terrible 2. Require absurd amounts of licensing 3. Are too much of a niche market to make any profit (Tokimeki Memorial, Sakura Wars, etc) 4. Can't really cross cultural differences
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Pollyanna 1132th Post
Red Carpet Premium Member+
| "Re(9):Mmmmhh..." , posted Mon 30 May 06:32
I have Mitsurugi and I don't think he invalidates Kagekiyo (YET), though he's a hell of a lot less trouble. I still get some of my highest damage attacks from Kagekiyo. He's almost up there with Kos-Mos. I don't think the balance is THAT off, though it's funny that you mentioned Ryu and Kos-Mos, since they're the obvious leaders of the pack. But then again...in any game with this many characters, you're going to have some winners and losers.
I think I said this before, but I very well might feel the same way as you 5 hours down the line...though I already agree that many of the fights are too long.
Also, Iggy...on your recommendation, I tried Sakura Taisen 3, but I think I've found the game that's too Japanese for me. It appeals to a sort of culture that I'm just not a part of. The battle system was good, and the dialogues were consistently funny, but it felt too "anime" if that makes any sense.
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Gojira 1737th Post
Tailored Carpet V.I.P- Platinum Member
| "Re(2):Re(10):Mmmmhh..." , posted Mon 30 May 15:26
I'm finally getting the hang of what everything stands for now, although it makes me sad that everything points to not using the option of skipping defense ever, or you'll never get a turn. If only defense was more interesting and less time-consuming...
What really bothers me (though not exactly in a bad way) is that you can use items and skills when you're being attacked. So if Morrigan is getting long-range attacked without enough meter to counter, I just use a skill that raises her meter a bit and then use the counterattack. It kind of feels like cheating, but I guess without it there would be even less strategy to defending. Oh well.
And I don't know how anyone could say Karin/ Sakura is weak. They're by far my strongest team now, already the first to hit level 30. They have close and long range counters, a ridiculous number of branches with too many hits per attack, an insane lethal move, and probably the most damaging MA in the game so far (2500 to TWO enemies). Anyone who calls them weak is doing something hideously wrong with them.
But then it's possible that nobody in the game is really weak... just when I think a team is too weak to do anything I level them up and suddenly they're killing units in one shot. This may not be true with everyone, but it sure is happening a lot.
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Gojira 1738th Post
Tailored Carpet V.I.P- Platinum Member
| "Re(2):Petition to bring this game to the US a" , posted Tue 31 May 17:41
quote: Good God, if the game is THAT long, do they have anything to offer for the 2nd half? Do you keep learning new skills and fighting new enemies at least? I can't imagine they have that much to offer.
Well, not exactly new, but a lot of the enemy units start to join after the halfway point, either as partners or single units. So while they're technically not new characters, they do add something. Like after Wayahime joins, Taki's lethal move changes, but not quite to the one in the trailer (I guess that comes after much leveling up). I don't know how long this continues... maybe by the end of the game just about every single enemy unit (save for the monsters and grunts) will be on your side.
Oh well, whatever it is someone else here will find out before me, since I have to stop playing the game or I'll never get back to work. I've only got a week left before break anyway, no point in slacking off now.
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