jazz fusion in 80s games: RK mission start! - http://www.mmcafe.com/ Forums

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Maou

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"Jazz fusion in 80s games: go go Red Knight" , posted Tue 14 Jul 09:57:

Per the grade-A entry on 80s jazz fusion influences on game soundtracks in the SFV thread, Red Knight, mission start! CAN YOU PUNCH THE WAY TO GLORY?

The part about the composers needing to be sound programmers first is accurate and important. Happily, some people ended up being both, and I imagine that the developing hardware only helped get more and more musically talented composers into the mix. I'd love to hear more about the specific tracks you hear being...borrowed. Modern stuff is easier, like how everyone knows that Wild Arms' superb "Wayfarer of the Wilderness" came from "The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly", and composers talk about the influence of the Yellow Magic Orchestra (YMO) and Sakamoto Ryuuichi, but I bet most in our generation in Japan, the US, and elsewhere have no clue about the 80s Famicom-jazz legacy anymore.

But, well, I always went for 1970s-1980s Shouwa era pop, so I'm useless in this thread, but that doesn't mean I'm not going to keep posting unrelated links of seminal and pop singers like Barbee Boys, Watanabe Misato, and Pink Lady until Red Knight shows up.

IGGY BONUS: It's Guile's theme...or is it?!

人間はいつも私を驚かせてくれる。不思議なものだな、人間という存在は．．．

[this message was edited by Maou on Wed 15 Jul 01:32]

Replies:

Iggy

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"Re(1):jazz fusion in 80s games: RK mission st" , posted Wed 15 Jul 00:46

I absolutely cannot contribute to this conversation as my musical culture is a disgrace to my astral chart, but I will read it religiously.

To make readers understand the importance of the topic, I think the amazing link TheRedKnight posted in the previous thread should be in the OP.

Youloute
12th Post

New Customer

"Re(2):jazz fusion in 80s games: RK mission st" , posted Wed 15 Jul 01:31:

A few tracks inspired from the work of some of the artists mentioned in the OP.

Sonic 1 8bit ver. - Bridge zone and Casiopea - Step Doughter

Animal Crossing - 9AM and Yellow Magic Orchestra - Simoon

Rolling Thunder 3 - Dammbad and T-SQUARE - Megalith

[this message was edited by Youloute on Wed 15 Jul 01:35]

TheRedKnight

406th Post

Gold Customer

"Re(3):jazz fusion in 80s games: RK mission st" , posted Wed 15 Jul 03:32

Great links Youloute!

There's a slight problem here. I don't want to post links that just result in people listening to a couple of songs for the sake of fighting game fandom.

Here's a full concert by T-Square: "Natural Live"

Check it out. They're the best band on the face of the earth. Masahiro Andoh has composed music for Arc The Lad and Gran Turismo so I'm pretty sure he knows what's up.

Also, I'd like to point out that I was drunk (surprise, surprise) and overstated in the SFV thread when I implied that all 80s video game music owed everything to Japanese jazz fusion. But you get the idea. I also created a thread about "borrowed" tunes some years ago already, but it went nowhere. Back then I had no clue about T-Square, though. I really don't want to participate in something that just becomes a part of fighting game trivia. The games are fun and all, but I have to say I loathe the fighting game scene these days..

videograpple.tumblr.com/

karasu

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"Re(4):jazz fusion in 80s games: RK mission st" , posted Wed 15 Jul 03:43

quote:

There's a slight problem here. I don't want to post links that just result in people listening to a couple of songs for the sake of fighting game fandom.

Not at all. I'm interested in finding out more about the scene because I genuinely enjoy the music. I know next to nothing about Japanese popular music, period (despite enjoying what little I do know quite a bit), so anything you provide is an education for me.

quote:

Here's a full concert by T-Square: "Natural Live"

Check it out. They're the best band on the face of the earth. Masahiro Andoh has composed music for Arc The Lad and Gran Turismo so I'm pretty sure he knows what's up.

Queueing it up to give a listen while I finish my afternoon of work. Thanks!

quote:
Also, I'd like to point out that I was drunk (surprise, surprise) and overstated in the SFV thread when I implied that all 80s video game music owed everything to Japanese jazz fusion.

It's okay, I was drunk while replying to your original post, so that adds a nice bit of symmetry.

You have to carefully reproduce the world of "Castlevania" in the solemn atmosphere.

Maou

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"Jazz fusion: mission expansion" , posted Wed 15 Jul 04:00:

quote:
There's a slight problem here. I don't want to post links that just result in people listening to a couple of songs for the sake of fighting game fandom.

That's fair! I'm more interested in keeping this to game music as it relates to the 80's and early 90's, especially on the jazz fusion line. There are a million threads on the internet about how game song A is taken from song B, it's true, so it may be better to focus on a specific type of music and a specific time of game composition.

But then again, I don't know anything about jazz fusion beyond what I've passively heard over the years, so in the meantime, listen to the unparalled 80's pop magnificence of Wada Kanako's voice and Sagisu Shirou's groovy soundtracks while we wait for Red Knight to come back.

人間はいつも私を驚かせてくれる。不思議なものだな、人間という存在は．．．

[this message was edited by Maou on Wed 15 Jul 04:01]

Spoon

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"Jazz fusion: zero mission" , posted Wed 15 Jul 08:17

quote:
There's a slight problem here. I don't want to post links that just result in people listening to a couple of songs for the sake of fighting game fandom.

I wouldn't worry about that, even though we get to be hard-headed about our fighting game opinions at times, in general I think we're just interested about the art and zeitgeist enough that we'd just like to know about things we've missed entirely.

I have to dig up this song I found months ago that I told karasu about because it sounded like the progenitor of every 16-bit credits song of the 90s.

karasu

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"Re(1):Jazz fusion: zero mission" , posted Wed 15 Jul 08:32

quote:

I have to dig up this song I found months ago that I told karasu about because it sounded like the progenitor of every 16-bit credits song of the 90s.

Oh! It was "Feels So Good" by Chuck Mangione!

You have to carefully reproduce the world of "Castlevania" in the solemn atmosphere.

Gieflos
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"Re(2):Jazz fusion: zero mission" , posted Thu 16 Jul 10:38

Great topic!

Growing up I've found that my ears always lead me back to video game music, no matter how hard I try. Hated jazz as a kid, yet I'd listen to Mega Man 3 or Castlevania IV music daily. As an adult I found Casiopea and fell in love. Down the rabbit hole I went, unknowingly tracking back to my original home of FM synth. Not until really digging into the sound teams of the '90s did I see the connection. Nostalgia is very powerful.

It's very apparent that the SST Band is channeling the fusion bands of the era here.

Listen to Isamu Ohashi performing and try not to picture Shingo running across the screen. KoF95 on PSX was maybe the 1st time I admitted love for jazz.

The YMO influence was strong as well - FAKE

Did you know that Shinji Hosoe had a parody YMO band alongside his Supersweep partners? Oriental Magnetic Yellow

Redbook audio pointed the spotlight on my love of jazz and jazz fusion and to this day I still can't get enough. That high energy sound is like adrenaline to me. Watch T-Square perform, they're always smiling!

Mosquiton

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"Re(3):Jazz fusion: zero mission" , posted Fri 17 Jul 12:17

quote:
Great topic!

I'm really enjoying the info and links here. Always worth realizing that no musical style just springs out of nowhere and influences are carried on and mutated into new and wonderful things.

quote:

Listen to Isamu Ohashi performing and try not to picture Shingo running across the screen. KoF95 on PSX was maybe the 1st time I admitted love for jazz.

Whoa, I like this a lot.

/ / /

Maese

774th Post

Red Carpet Regular Member+

"Re(4):Jazz fusion: zero mission" , posted Fri 17 Jul 17:32:

This topic is amazing. Sadly I have very little to contribute but, since I am enjoying it immensely, I think at least I should drop by and thank you guys for your awesome, enlightening contributions. I know I sound like a broken record, but MMCafe rocks really hard. I had no idea these bands even existed (well, most of them at least) and now I find myself listening to Casiopea and T-Square every morning to cheer my mood up on my way to work. It might be just pure and simple nostalgia factor, but I totally *love* how these bands sound. And I'm glad to see that I'm not alone! Gieflos summed it up better than I could:

quote:
Growing up I've found that my ears always lead me back to video game music, no matter how hard I try.

Same here! This stuff is the music of my youth (without me even knowing)!

[this message was edited by Maese on Fri 17 Jul 17:33]

Maese

774th Post

Red Carpet Regular Member+

"Re(4):Jazz fusion: zero mission" , posted Fri 17 Jul 17:32:

****Double post DAMAGEx2****

[this message was edited by Maese on Fri 17 Jul 17:35]

Maou

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"Re(5):Jazz fusion: zero mission" , posted Sat 18 Jul 04:50:

quote:
I know I sound like a broken record, but MMCafe rocks really hard. I had no idea these bands even existed

You bet it does! But you were already on the right path with your proper appreciation of shouwa kayou, though...so awesome of Prof to have kept those albums for me and handed them off to you. We can always turn this into an 80s (Japanese) pop thread if the focused jazz fusion doesn't take off. It's such a marvelous decade for music. Here: today people shall listen to Rebecca and Ann Lewis and more Watanabe Misato because one cannot possibly have too much.

人間はいつも私を驚かせてくれる。不思議なものだな、人間という存在は．．．

[this message was edited by Maou on Sat 18 Jul 05:06]

Spoon

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"Re(1):Jazz fusion: mission expansion" , posted Sun 19 Jul 03:11

quote:

But then again, I don't know anything about jazz fusion beyond what I've passively heard over the years, so in the meantime, listen to the unparalled 80's pop magnificence of Wada Kanako's voice

I thought I was listening to a bizarre arrangement of some Castlevania music for the first bit of this song

Maou

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"Re(2):Jazz fusion: kimagure expansion" , posted Sun 19 Jul 03:54:

quote:
Wada Kanako's voice

I thought I was listening to a bizarre arrangement of some Castlevania music for the first bit of this song

You were confused because you were listening to...god! Kimagure Orange Road is probably the most enjoyable primer possible in the unrelenting joys of 80s vocals and soundtrack composition because it comes packaged as part of one the finest TV adaptations I can recall of one of the most influential comics of that era. Maybe the OST is jazz fusion too? I just don't know enough about the genre, only what I'm used to listening to.

人間はいつも私を驚かせてくれる。不思議なものだな、人間という存在は．．．

[this message was edited by Maou on Sun 19 Jul 05:29]

chazumaru

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"Re(3):Jazz fusion: kimagure expansion" , posted Sun 19 Jul 21:50

There is always a good excuse to post this.

Même Narumi est épatée !

Maese

774th Post

Red Carpet Regular Member+

"Re(6):Jazz fusion: zero mission" , posted Mon 27 Jul 15:37

quote:
I know I sound like a broken record, but MMCafe rocks really hard. I had no idea these bands even existed
You bet it does! But you were already on the right path with your proper appreciation of shouwa kayou, though...so awesome of Prof to have kept those albums for me and handed them off to you. We can always turn this into an 80s (Japanese) pop thread if the focused jazz fusion doesn't take off. It's such a marvelous decade for music. Here: today people shall listen to Rebecca and Ann Lewis and more Watanabe Misato because one cannot possibly have too much.

I'll never be able to thank you (and Professor!) enough for that material! A treasure trove of musical goodness indeed. I have yet to go to that Showa era themed bar you recommended, but I'll probably fix that before the summer ends.

Now that we are at it, even if she's more Heisei material and not quite on the same league as Rebecca and the rest of Showa goddesses, I've always felt that Nanase Aikawa is one of the last exponents of that tradition of ladies with awesome voices that can actually sing. Her discography may be a little bit inconsistent, but many of her songs are genuinely interesting.

Spoon

2990th Post

Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master

"Re(7):Jazz fusion: zero mission" , posted Sat 1 Aug 02:39

Faces by T-Square

Holy cow, I have to wonder how many phrases of this song have been sampled/ripped/arranged in 16-bit era game music.

caiooa
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Rare Customer

"Re(8):Jazz fusion: zero mission" , posted Wed 5 Aug 22:42:

quote:
Faces by T-Square

Holy cow, I have to wonder how many phrases of this song have been sampled/ripped/arranged in 16-bit era game music.

Probably a lot. At the top of Formula One popularity, this theme was used in japanese television as "theme of Ayrton Senna"...at the top of his popularity as a driver.
Maybe the intro of kof 99's Iori theme (Sadistic Eyes) was based on it for example.

"TRUTH" was used too in japanese TV for Formula one.

Btw, risking going out of topic but...just downloaded Kara no shoujo episode 2 trial, and the ost blew my mind as much as the first game.
investigation
Days II

[this message was edited by caiooa on Thu 6 Aug 00:14]

Gieflos
110th Post

Regular Customer

"Re(9):Jazz fusion: zero mission" , posted Tue 23 Feb 01:35

I recently suggested a topic for a vgm podcast I like and thought that if any of you enjoyed this thread you might get a kick out of it.

Super Marcato Bros - Fusion!

Enjoy! I had a fun time picking out tracks. The tracks that they contributed are great as well.

I really enjoy this show. The hosts are both musicians and they definitely come at discussion from that angle. It's refreshing to hear mostly a smaller focus on nostalgia. I especially like when they dig deep into theory and hardware related stuff.

Maese

803th Post

Red Carpet Regular Member+

"Re(10):Jazz fusion: zero mission" , posted Wed 24 Feb 17:06

quote:
I recently suggested a topic for a vgm podcast I like and thought that if any of you enjoyed this thread you might get a kick out of it.

Super Marcato Bros - Fusion!

Enjoy! I had a fun time picking out tracks. The tracks that they contributed are great as well.

I really enjoy this show. The hosts are both musicians and they definitely come at discussion from that angle. It's refreshing to hear mostly a smaller focus on nostalgia. I especially like when they dig deep into theory and hardware related stuff.

This Super Marcato Bros podcast is an awesome discovery. Just as this thread, it helps you to enjoy videogame music from a whole new perspective. Thanks for sharing!

A Talking about Japanese History

sword in hand

nobinobita

1559th Post

Red Carpet V.I.P- Platinum Member

"Re(2):Re(10):Jazz fusion: zero mission" , posted Wed 24 Feb 17:25

quote:
I recently suggested a topic for a vgm podcast I like and thought that if any of you enjoyed this thread you might get a kick out of it.

Super Marcato Bros - Fusion!

Enjoy! I had a fun time picking out tracks. The tracks that they contributed are great as well.

I really enjoy this show. The hosts are both musicians and they definitely come at discussion from that angle. It's refreshing to hear mostly a smaller focus on nostalgia. I especially like when they dig deep into theory and hardware related stuff.

This Super Marcato Bros podcast is an awesome discovery. Just as this thread, it helps you to enjoy videogame music from a whole new perspective. Thanks for sharing!

Wow I'd never heard of them before. This is a GREAT podcast. Perfect to listen to while you work. And man, there's hundreds of episodes too! Thanks so much for sharing this!

www.art-eater.com

nobinobita

1560th Post

Red Carpet V.I.P- Platinum Member

"Re(3):Re(10):Jazz fusion: zero mission" , posted Wed 24 Feb 18:24

quote:
I recently suggested a topic for a vgm podcast I like and thought that if any of you enjoyed this thread you might get a kick out of it.

Super Marcato Bros - Fusion!

Enjoy! I had a fun time picking out tracks. The tracks that they contributed are great as well.

I really enjoy this show. The hosts are both musicians and they definitely come at discussion from that angle. It's refreshing to hear mostly a smaller focus on nostalgia. I especially like when they dig deep into theory and hardware related stuff.

This Super Marcato Bros podcast is an awesome discovery. Just as this thread, it helps you to enjoy videogame music from a whole new perspective. Thanks for sharing!

Wow I'd never heard of them before. This is a GREAT podcast. Perfect to listen to while you work. And man, there's hundreds of episodes too! Thanks so much for sharing this!

Making a note for myself to listen to these podcasts later:

Ep 7 - Castlevania
Ep 16 - Forest Music
Ep 26 - The History of Video Game Music
Ep 27 - Final Fantasy
Ep 44 - Pokemon
Ep 94 - Chrono Trigger
Ep 95 - Best of Playstation
Ep 102 - Street Fighter
Ep 128 - Chrono Cross and Xenogears
Ep 119 - Mega Man
Ep 182 - Final Fantasy 1-3
Ep 183 - Final Fantasy 4-6

www.art-eater.com

Gieflos
111th Post

Regular Customer

"Re(4):Re(10):Jazz fusion: zero mission" , posted Thu 25 Feb 13:16

quote:
Making a note for myself to listen to these podcasts later:

Ep 7 - Castlevania
Ep 16 - Forest Music
Ep 26 - The History of Video Game Music
Ep 27 - Final Fantasy
Ep 44 - Pokemon
Ep 94 - Chrono Trigger
Ep 95 - Best of Playstation
Ep 102 - Street Fighter
Ep 128 - Chrono Cross and Xenogears
Ep 119 - Mega Man
Ep 182 - Final Fantasy 1-3
Ep 183 - Final Fantasy 4-6

Very glad to hear some interest for these guys!

I like when they explore more conceptual subjects. Nobi, look for episodes that feature Marty's Corner, a great segment that digs right into music theory.

Some of my favorite recent episodes are:

Ep 203 - Etrian Odyssey
Ep 201 - Five Finger Fanfare
Ep 192 - Yoshi's Wooly World
Ep 191 - Kazumi Totaka
Ep 174 - Breakdown & Analysis Vol.II

They tend to have an interview with a composer about once each season. Those are definitely worth checking out as well.

Mosquiton

2133th Post

Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master

"Re(5):Re(10):Jazz fusion: zero mission" , posted Mon 7 Mar 05:55:

quote:
Making a note for myself to listen to these podcasts later:

Ep 7 - Castlevania
Ep 16 - Forest Music
Ep 26 - The History of Video Game Music
Ep 27 - Final Fantasy
Ep 44 - Pokemon
Ep 94 - Chrono Trigger
Ep 95 - Best of Playstation
Ep 102 - Street Fighter
Ep 128 - Chrono Cross and Xenogears
Ep 119 - Mega Man
Ep 182 - Final Fantasy 1-3
Ep 183 - Final Fantasy 4-6

Very glad to hear some interest for these guys!

I like when they explore more conceptual subjects. Nobi, look for episodes that feature Marty's Corner, a great segment that digs right into music theory.

Some of my favorite recent episodes are:

Ep 203 - Etrian Odyssey
Ep 201 - Five Finger Fanfare
Ep 192 - Yoshi's Wooly World
Ep 191 - Kazumi Totaka
Ep 174 - Breakdown & Analysis Vol.II

They tend to have an interview with a composer about once each season. Those are definitely worth checking out as well.

I'm really into this, thanks Gieflos.

Edit: And wow, these guys are very smart and very considerate of new listeners. Really cool stuff.

/ / /

[this message was edited by Mosquiton on Mon 7 Mar 05:59]

nobinobita

1563th Post

Red Carpet V.I.P- Platinum Member

"Re(6):Re(10):Jazz fusion: zero mission" , posted Thu 10 Mar 12:29

quote:
Making a note for myself to listen to these podcasts later:

Ep 7 - Castlevania
Ep 16 - Forest Music
Ep 26 - The History of Video Game Music
Ep 27 - Final Fantasy
Ep 44 - Pokemon
Ep 94 - Chrono Trigger
Ep 95 - Best of Playstation
Ep 102 - Street Fighter
Ep 128 - Chrono Cross and Xenogears
Ep 119 - Mega Man
Ep 182 - Final Fantasy 1-3
Ep 183 - Final Fantasy 4-6

Very glad to hear some interest for these guys!

I like when they explore more conceptual subjects. Nobi, look for episodes that feature Marty's Corner, a great segment that digs right into music theory.

Some of my favorite recent episodes are:

Ep 203 - Etrian Odyssey
Ep 201 - Five Finger Fanfare
Ep 192 - Yoshi's Wooly World
Ep 191 - Kazumi Totaka
Ep 174 - Breakdown & Analysis Vol.II

They tend to have an interview with a composer about once each season. Those are definitely worth checking out as well.

I'm really into this, thanks Gieflos.

Edit: And wow, these guys are very smart and very considerate of new listeners. Really cool stuff.

I've been enjoying these so much. This is by far and away my favorite video game podcast ever. The way these guys speak about music is the way I aim to speak about art. They're so well informed, and so well meaning too.

I've actually just been going through their podcasts in chronological order. It's the perfect thing to listen to at work.

Here are some random thoughts on/from the podcast:

-I usually expect game music nerds of my generation to worship at the altar of Squaresoft. It's really cool that they love Koji Kondo and Nintendo music so much.

-They made a really nice observation about how hardware limitations drove what kind of music appeared on each system. For instance the Genesis is better at synth keyboard/techo instruments while the SNES was the first console to have respectable string sounds, giving way to much more orchestral scores.

-I love how they describe the appeal of game music. The earliest consoles were extremely limited, so composers had to work very hard to get good music out of the system. They had to be creative and efficient. And they also had to compose music that loops over and over, but doesn't get annoying, yet can't be too indistinct either. At it's best, the result is some of the catchiest, most iconic tunes every composed. Nostalgia is a factor, but not the only factor (as evidenced by how they keep finding new 8bit tunes that they love from games they've never even played)

-I'm learning a lot about music terminology from these guys! Also, did you know "timber" is pronounced "TAM-bur" like tamborine? And not like that sound lumberjacks make when a tree is falling! #TheMoreYouKnow

Thanks a million for spreading the word about these guys. These podcasts are such a pleasure to listen to throughout the day!

www.art-eater.com

Gieflos

113th Post

Regular Customer

"Re(7):Re(10):Manami Matsumae interview" , posted Mon 18 Jul 22:48:

Exclusive Manami Matsumae Interview 2016

The latest Super Marcato Bros episode includes an exclusive interview with Manami Matsumae. There is some fun info here that I haven't heard anywhere else. It's tragic to me that Takashi Tateishi felt like he was muscled out of game music composition.

I was able to meet her at MAGfest as well. It was surreal!

Just to keep things tied to the original subject, I was very happy to hear that the Pat Metheny Group played a big influence in her music. I always love to hear what was creeping into the ears of the musicians I love while they create their own magic.

[this message was edited by Gieflos on Mon 18 Jul 22:51]

Spoon
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"Re(8):Re(10):Manami Matsumae interview" , posted Tue 19 Jul 02:50

quote:
Takashi Tateishi

There is an interview with him as well as a really sad-note ending interview with the composer of the original Ninja Gaiden games at http://www.bravewave.net

The NG guy says something to the extent of the modern gaming industry doesn't seem to want the kind of music that he makes, and I remember the first time I read it, it ruined my whole day.

Mosquiton
2190th Post

Platinum Carpet V.I.P- Board Master

"Re(8):Re(10):Manami Matsumae interview" , posted Tue 19 Jul 08:41

quote:
Exclusive Manami Matsumae Interview 2016

The latest Super Marcato Bros episode includes an exclusive interview with Manami Matsumae. There is some fun info here that I haven't heard anywhere else. It's tragic to me that Takashi Tateishi felt like he was muscled out of game music composition.

I was able to meet her at MAGfest as well. It was surreal!

Just to keep things tied to the original subject, I was very happy to hear that the Pat Metheny Group played a big influence in her music. I always love to hear what was creeping into the ears of the musicians I love while they create their own magic.

I knew I would like these guys when I saw how much respect these guys have for UN Squadron. Great interview questions, too. It's obvious they know their stuff. And huge respect for this composer.

/ / /

Tai-Pan
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"Re(9):Re(10):Manami Matsumae interview" , posted Tue 26 Jul 12:16

quote:

There is an interview with him as well as a really sad-note ending interview with the composer of the original Ninja Gaiden games at http://www.bravewave.net

I've bought most of their releases. Wish Brave Wave Productions had more work coming their way. Some of the people they work with are my personal heroes and seeing them in this time and age and still using their skill set is really bittersweet.

"Those who follow the path of a warrior must be ready to die in order to stand for one's convictions live for one's convictions die for one's convictions"